In this week’s episode of Enterprise Software Podcast, Todd, Bob & Darcy discuss the latest industry news, and interview Ed Kless, Senior Director at Sage Accountants Solutions.
As the senior director of partner development and strategy for North America, Ed develops and delivers the curriculum for the Sage Consulting Academy, a course designed to educate Sage Software partners on the art and practice of small business consulting. He also facilitates the Sage Leadership Academy, a yearlong program designed to assist Sage Software partners develop a continuous process of improvement in their organizations and serves as liaison to the Sage Leadership Academy Alumni Association.
The topics covered in this episode include:
- Oracle Lays Off More Than 1,000 Employees
- TARGIT Acquired
- InsideSales $50M Round Includes Microsoft
- Ed Kless The Soul of Enterprise
- Ed Kless Sage Advice Podcast
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In case you prefer to read the transcript:
Episode 58 Transcription
BOB Enterprise Software Podcast Episode #58 and before we get to our interview with Ed Kless, discussing Innovation Beyond Technology, we’ve got a small handful of items that made the news recently. What do we got listed there first?
TODD Well, probably the most interesting thing is the Sage 50 Office 365 integration that was announced.
DARCY Specifically Sage 50C.
BOB Please get it right.
DARCY Yea, let’s get that part.
TODD Anyways, so Microsoft continuing with their friendly competitor Sage, making sure that even though you’re using a Sage accounting package, you’re still gonna get signed up on Office 365 by providing some hooks between two products. So that strategy continues even with the admin of Dynamics 365.
BOB And Sage is a cloud solutions provider, right?
TODD Yes. Yes.
BOB So if I made this relatively easy.
TODD So speaking of Dynamics 365, we’d like to put a question out there. If anybody knows of anyone actually running Dynamics 365 financials in a live environment, we’d love to hear about it. We have asked everyone we know and haven’t heard of one yet.
DARCY Okay, you said Dynamics 365 Financials.
TODD Financials/Business edition. The old project Madeira, whatever you wanna call it, we’d love to know of somebody actually paying for and running that in a environment. And Rod O’Connor, you don’t count ‘cause you’re a partner. But somebody who’s an actual end user. Because I’m just curious. I mean I have asked every partner that I’ve spoken to, have they heard of anything and we haven’t heard of one yet, so.
BOB And if we find one we will rocket them to the top of the interview list.
TODD Absolutely, yes.
BOB Todd wants to talk to you.
TODD Inquiring minds want to know. So please, let us know. Alrighty, what’s next on the news list?
BOB Looks like Oracle had some layoffs.
TODD Some? Yea, 1,000 employees.
BOB 1,000 people. Can you imagine that?
TODD It hardly even makes the news. 1,000 layoffs.
BOB Yea. I mean how many people does Oracle employ?
TODD Who knows?
BOB It’s gotta be tens of thousands.
TODD So anyways. It looked like primarily in the old hardware Solaris SPARC systems, the old side of the business that they acquired, I guess a lot from Sun back in 2009. So some of those people starting to phase out. It’s kind of funny to even think about Sun Microsystems Hardware anymore, isn’t it?
BOB Yea, yea. True. In 2009. Was it that long ago?
TODD Yea. It does seem a little crazy, but. But anyways, we only bring it up ‘cause of the recent acquisition, I guess you’d say, of NetSuite by Oracle. That makes it pertinent or interesting, I guess. And then some news from your friends at Targit.
BOB Yea, yea. Targit, which is a Danish company with their US headquarters here in Tampa was just acquired. They have a BI Suite, lots of BI tools. And they were purchased by a company called GRO Capital, G-R-O. And Morten Sandlykke was CEO and he’s officially resigned, transaction completed.
TODD In the bank.
BOB Money in the bank, yea exactly. And my friend Ulrich Peterson, who has been CTO and COO here in Florida is now the CEO of Targit US. So congratulations Ulrich. Good job, young man. He’s a good guy.
TODD There you go. That’s Targit with an “i” in case you were wondering.
BOB That’s right. T-A-R-G-I-T.
DARCY BI is a crowded space, isn’t it?
BOB It is, yea, but
TODD It is.
BOB Targit does a lot of business in Europe. Lot.
TODD And big fans of skydiving, it seems, from all of their
BOB Right, from some of their past events. That’s right.
TODD Yea, you could win a skydiving trip with them at one of the GPUG Summit events.
BOB I don’t think I’m gonna be jumping out of a plane any time soon.
TODD “Win” being in quotes, yea. Yea, no thank you.
DARCY We have one more piece of news. Inside Sales announces a $50 million investment, including some funds from Microsoft.
TODD I think another thing that is interesting there, too, is that Salesforce is an investor in that company also. So both Microsoft and Salesforce invested in the same analytics platform. Gotta say analytics, big data, whatever you wanna say, but around sales people, finding prospects and gettin’ deals goin’. So $50 million round, so they are total up to $201.2 million in funding.
BOB Wow. Nice.
TODD Yea. It’s not bad.
DARCY That’s not more than Avalara, though.
TODD No, no, no. I think
DARCY We’re not talking Avalara money here.
TODD No, no, no.
BOB And don’t forget the Irish government is also involved in this transaction. Let’s not leave that out.
TODD Yea, the Irish Strategic Investment Fund, the ventures funding arm of the Irish government. Does the US have a venture funding arm?
BOB I’ve never heard of that. Does any government have that?
DARCY No way.
TODD Strange, that is strange. But anyway, so Microsoft, Salesforce, and the entire country of Ireland.
BOB Time now for an interview segment. Today we’re pleased to welcome back our friend Ed Kless. He’s a director at Sage Accountants Solutions. He was with us on the year end superpodcast. We spent some time in late December with Jason Gumpert and Peter Wolf and Wayne Schulz. And we even had Ed on in the summer of 2015 when we were all in New Orleans at Sage Summit. So Ed, welcome back once again to Enterprise Software Podcast.
ED Well, thank you so much for having me back on. And I’m actually pleased to say that my prediction on that show has already come true. I don’t know if you recall, but I said something about that Bitcoin or Blockchain would be a factor in ERP. And I think it was McCullough of all people announced that they are integrating or exact software, I should say now, right? Is looking towards having Bitcoin and taking cryptocurrency. So there you go.
TODD That is interesting. Not the ERP I would have expected to be first in line on that.
BOB No. No, not at all.
TODD I’ll leave it at that, but yea. That’s good.
DARCY That’s great, but Skynet still has not taken over, so Peter Wolf is out of luck on his prediction. So Ed has another nickname, too. I don’t know if you guys know this, but he’s also known as Human Coffee.
BOB I didn’t know that. Human Coffee.
TODD I was wondering where all that.
ED I didn’t know that.
DARCY Alright, I heard you called that once. I thought it was pretty funny. It kinda stuck with me.
TODD I wonder where all that energy comes from.
BOB So Ed, since it’s been a few weeks since you were on and you were on with a bunch of people
TODD That’s right.
BOB Why don’t you reintroduce yourself to those who don’t know you.
ED Sure. Well I’ve been at Sage for almost 14 years now and I have the best job at Sage. I’ve told this to 3 or 4 CEOs now that they have the highest profile job, but I have the best job because my job is helping business partners, whether they be accountants or bookkeepers or resellers of our software, make their businesses better. And I love helping people make their businesses better and I think I do one job, and hopefully it helps Sage, hopefully it helps our partner organizations, and then also in the end it helps customers. So it’s sort of like Norm, ‘member when he had the beer tasting job? I do one job and I get three times the benefit. But before that, I did own a reselling organization in northern New Jersey that did what is now known as Microsoft Dynamics GP.
BOB You ever heard of that, Todd?
TODD No, I’m unfamiliar. I only know 365. That’s the only product I know anymore.
BOB You know when I first met you in New Orleans a couple years ago, you said the same thing. That you had the best job at Sage.
BOB I remember that.
ED Yup. Yup, I still do. It’s awesome. I mean, as part of my gig, I do a podcast as you know for Voice America called the Soul of Enterprise. I also do a podcast for Sage called The Sage Advice Podcast. And in the case of the second one, the Sage Advice Podcast, that started because I just started it and nobody told me I couldn’t do it.
BOB Good for you.
ED And now it’s part of my job, part of my gig, so
DARCY Yea, Sage is promoting that in the newsletters to the channel and everything. They put the latest podcast in there.
BOB Do they? That’s nice.
DARCY You’re like all official now.
ED Yea. And only because I decided I wanted to do a podcast and try it and learn stuff and nobody told me to stop so I just did it.
TODD Nice. So we have you on today to talk about Innovation Beyond Technology, which is a topic that you speak on at several conferences and things around the world, I guess we could say.
ED Yea, and it was one of those fortuitous, serendipitous moments. I was asked to pinch hit and speak for Jennifer Warawa. I don’t know if any of you guys have, I know Darcy, I’m sure you’ve met Jennifer. She was in charge of the Sage Accountants channel and now is, I don’t know. I think we all report to Jennifer. She’s some global, super VP of something. But she’s always flying all over the place. Anyway, she asked me to pinch hit for her at a sessions thing that she was doing called Innovating Beyond Technology. And she says, good news Ed is that I have all of the slides developed and so you just need to go in and do this presentation for me. I think it was at a New York/New Jersey CPA show, actually. And of course she sent me the slides and I’m like, well I’m not doing this presentation. I have no idea what you’re talking about, right? So what I did is I took a couple of the slides that made a little bit of sense to me and then I just built a presentation of mine around the topic. And ever since, I’ve been offering this as one of the presentations that I do and I’ve had the chance to do it. I did it at ITA last time. And it’s just a fun session because it got me thinking in a place that I hadn’t thought before. And that is the subject of Innovating Beyond Technology. And the reason is, I think people have conflated it. So for example, if I ask you guys, when you think of innovation, what comes to your mind? Just curious, what comes to your guys’ minds?
TODD Things like Bitcoin.
BOB Driverless cars, like we talked about in December.
TODD Yea. Amazon drones.
ED So it’s usually around some sort of technology, whether it’s Cloud or the iPad or Tesla. Something like that, some piece of technology comes to mind, but one of the things that I discovered in prepping for this session was a great quote from Andy Grove, the founder of Intel, who in his book Only the Paranoid Survive, I think it’s called, he said, “Disruptive threats come inherently not from new technology, but from new business models.” And here’s a guy, founder of Intel. You would think that okay, he’s gonna be all about the technology, but he said, no no no, it’s actually about the change to the business model that has the impact. And of course the example that we see today is Uber, right?
ED Uber is not so much a change to the technology. It certainly did use current technologies and did put them together in a new and innovative way. But the real change was the business model, right? And the big change was the fact that for a taxi, when you call a taxi, the big problem was that you didn’t know when it was gonna show up, right? You know, they say 20 minutes, but you had no clue. But now with Uber you say, ok well the guy is 2 minutes away, right? And it completely changes the way that you think about getting a ride.
TODD We were talking about that this week. I was on a trip and we were all leaving a conference room and we had four people going four different directions. We’re all standing out there on the sidewalk with our phones, watching our Uber cars coming in. And it’s like, how did we travel before Uber? That hasn’t been that long ago. I mean it’s not like ten years ago. I mean that was two years ago we weren’t using Uber that much. And now it’s just as soon as you get up to leave somewhere, everybody opens up their Uber app.
BOB It’s the first thing they think of.
ED Yup. Yup. And you’ve even seen like the Uberization of other things. And by that, I mean I hear, I haven’t been back to New York City in quite some time, but most platforms in New York City now have an LED display that tells you when the next train is coming, right? So the expectation has become around this notion of, well I’m okay with waiting as long as I know how long I’m gonna have to wait.
TODD Right, right.
ED Right? And certainly that technology has been around for quite some time, but. So that got me to thinking about all of these different ways in which companies can innovate, but not necessarily change the technology. And let me give you an example of this. I’ve got lots of examples that we can talk about, but I want to give you an example that I think you can apply in the businesses that we’re in, right? But this one, believe it or not, comes from a car company, from Audi. And it’s an innovation in pricing, right? And it’s not bill by the hour. That’s different. We did that show already, okay?
DARCY I was gonna say, where are you going with this, Ed?
TODD Always comes back to pricing.
ED I promise not to go down that path unless you insist. This is an innovation for pricing for cars that is really unbelievable when you think about it. So Audi had been test marketing this car and one of the things that they did is they AB tested two different scenarios. One where the car had a sticker price of 34,000 euro, right? And then they offered a discount of $3,000. And then a trade in, so say your car that you were trading in was worth $7,000, right? Bringing the final price of the car to $24,000. So $3,000 discount and then $7,000 on the trade in, k? Here’s what they did and that was the A market. Then the B market was this. It took the sticker price, which was the same 34,000 euro, took the trade in value of 7,000. But then they said instead of a $3,000 discount, sorry euro discount, they’d give you a 3,000 euro trade in bonus, right? So they’re giving you $3,000 on top of your trade in price as opposed to $3,000 off the sticker price. The accountant in you is saying well that’s the same thing, right?
TODD Yea, but the marketing people do math differently.
ED Right? Well it’s the same thing if you’re an accountant, just not if you’re a human being, right? Because the $3,000 on top of, and I keep saying dollars but it was euros. The 3,000 on top of the trade in made for a better deal in the mind of the customer. Like, oh wow. You’re giving me 3,000 euro on top of the 7,000 euro from my crappy piece of car?
BOB I was thinking you were gonna go to the hold back calculation, say oh ok, now it’s 3,000 more on the calculation for the dealer.
ED No. No, no, no. It’s the same. In the end, it’s the same final price, but just the presentation was different. And ready for this? So the B value where they did the trade in bonus on top of the trade in price increased the sales by over 300%, one market to the other.
BOB No kidding. 300%.
TODD Is that innovation or just a sign at how bad at math people are?
ED Well, recall that in the B market it’s not presented as both ways. It’s only presented as one way versus the other. So it’s not a question at being bad at math. It’s a question of the way that it works in our brain, right? The influence that it has in our brain. And this has long been documented, books like Dan Ariely’s Predicatbly Irrational. You know, that we can actually predict that people will be irrational in some context. And we can’t help it, right? You think that you’re a Mr. Spock, but sometimes you’re Homer Simpson no matter what.
BOB Or Dr. McCoy, Jim.
ED Yea, I’m a doctor, not an escalator.
TODD I think you just explained the reason the Kardashians exist.
ED Well, yea that’s partially true. But I wanna throw this at you, is like, we could use the same idea to solve a very real problem that we have in ERP solutions. And that is the never-ending demand for discounts by customers. Have you guys heard that? Is that something you run into occasionally?
BOB Todd, are people asking you for discounts a lot?
ED Right? So here’s my idea. Tell them, no we’re not going to give you a discount, but at the end of the project when you go live on your new system, we will buy your old system from you for say $10,000. We’ll buy it from you. And we’re gonna write you a check for 10 grand.
ED Right? So we won’t give you a discount, but we will buy your old system from you when you go live on the new system. Now think of a couple things that this accomplishes. One, it still gives them this perception that they’re getting this discount, right? Although if you’re properly pricing you could bill potentially that back in. But even more importantly, what does it do from a motivational standpoint to get them up and running on the new system?
DARCY Oh yea, it incents them to get up and running sooner to get their money.
DARCY Well I think it also sets a precedent, instead of setting a precedent that we’re gonna offer you a discount any time you ask for one, it sets a precedent that hey we’re gonna work with you this time in this way. So they’re not gonna come back to you next time, hey I know you discount, so where’s my discount?
ED Correct. Correct, right? And then here’s the other thing, too, is that signal of you writing the check for them to buy their old system from you is also an indicator that the project is complete, isn’t it?
TODD Yea, I’m taking notes. This will be going on our website next week, I think.
ED And the other thing that I hear, and this might not be you guys, but I hear occasionally from partner organizations, you know, we have a real difficulty understanding when a project ends.
BOB Well in some cases, that’s entirely true, yes.
TODD It’s when the money runs out, isn’t it?
ED This also potentially solves that problem, doesn’t it? Because you can say okay, in order for them to say hey we want our money, they have to say yes, this project is done. We are live on the system.
TODD We have an ISV in the GP community that does this on a regular basis. EOne does this. If you have a competitor to one of their products, they will buy it back from you after you purchase and implement one of their products. So he runs that, usually around shows, but he runs the. He calls it the trade in, but it’s essentially the same.
BOB You’re talking about Martin Olsen.
TODD Yea. So interesting. But I never thought about the downstream effect of that, of it being the close of the project and getting the customer incentivized and involved to get it live.
BOB Right, and to draw a line that we’re done. And we’re presumably happy or satisfied, yea.
DARCY So this is very innovative, but does not involve new technology.
ED There ya go.
TODD Captain Obvious.
ED Hence the title of the session. And there’s so many other examples of this that are in business. And I think the key is to be able to make the shift from okay, so how does it apply in what we see out there to then bringing it down to the stuff that we do. Another example that I’ll give you guys is the story behind the size of the Red Bull can. Have you heard about this?
DARCY No. Yea, why are they that size? That’s annoying.
BOB But they’re slim, yea.
ED Right? Red Bull made a conscious decision not to put their product in a standard 12 oz can, right? And their rationale for it was pretty interesting. They said because if we do that, people will compare us to soda. They’re gonna make that comparison.
TODD Oh, okay.
ED Whereas we change the size of the container and make it smaller. First of all, what will people think? If it’s smaller, it’s what? Concentrated, right?
BOB Fully loaded, yea.
TODD I’m such an accountant. I’m thinking, more expensive per ounce?
DARCY I’m thinking, won’t fit in any of my koozies?
ED But they made that conscious decision to make their packaging different from other people’s packaging because they didn’t wanna be compared to other people in the space, right?
ED So again, the question I would then ask, and I don’t have the direct answer for this one, but what is it that your organization can do to change its container, to change its packaging so that you’re not compared to others in your space?
TODD That’s a great question, especially as an ERP partner. We do kinda all have the same package, let’s be honest.
ED I could probably look at ten, and I’ve done this too, ERP websites, right? Pull off what I find to be their mission statement, and put them up on a screen and ask you to identify your own mission statement, and nobody would be able to do it.
DARCY Oh my.
TODD Well, we all got the ERP mission statement generator that came with our Microsoft partnership.
BOB Is that part of your VAR signup?
TODD I believe so, yea. We’re gonna add value to our client organizations. That’s always an important statement.
DARCY Ed, so who in the ERP space has done something well and not along these regards? Can you think of anyone? Any examples?
ED Well, of course one of the previous guests on the show, Wayne Schulz has done this for years, right? I think if you look at his site s-consult, or at least if you did. I haven’t been there in a while, you can tell that Wayne is a different guy.
TODD Yes, yes.
ED Right? There used to be pictures of his kids. It was not the standard fare when you went to Wayne’s site, right? He even for a time had an example of a chat, and you can ask him about the story. It’s a great story where Wayne is always playing with stuff, right? And he played with this, click here for chat. And some guy chatted and he’s going back and forth with the guy. And he gives him the standard answer, you know, here’s what you can do to rebuild your file or I forget what the actual situation was. And it turns out that that didn’t solve the problem. So Wayne said, I’m sorry. This has gone beyond this free level of support. If you’re interested, you can go onto my page and I’d be happy to come out and do a, you know I forget what he charges. $100 or $1,000 for his diagnosis of the situation. And the guy replies back, F you.
TODD That escalated quickly.
ED Right? So what does Wayne do? Wayne cuts that and pastes that and puts it on his website, right? And says, if this is the kind of conversation you’re gonna have with me, don’t call me.
BOB And no one ever gave him a hard time like that again.
ED Well, because he’s defining himself by the customers he doesn’t want, right? Rather than the customers he wants, which is a great innovation. We’ve all heard the Nigerian prince scams, right? And you’ve gotten those emails and people always make fun of them because the spelling is so bad and all of the stuff. And people always say, how can anybody fall for this? And you do realize that those misspellings and grammar, they’re on purpose, right?
ED It’s not because they can’t run their message through a grammar check or somewhere. That’s part of the marketing scam. Hopefully, the four of us on this podcast are not gonna fall for something where we see such drastic misspellings, right?
ED But somebody who doesn’t catch those misspellings, doesn’t see that as blatantly obvious, right? Who doesn’t see the misspellings, they’re gonna fall for it.
BOB They’re gonna be more reassured than ever, really.
ED And that’s who they want. They want people who don’t catch the misspellings. That’s what they want. So it’s an intentional target to leave that stuff in there.
TODD Wow. Marketing to your target audience in a really strange way.
BOB But effective.
TODD Yea. Yea, I guess. Yea.
ED We’re looking for stupid people.
TODD I’m gonna put that on my website. We’re looking for stupid people.
BOB Call us today.
TODD Yea. Misspell call.
ED Let me give you another example if I could of this. And this one I can, I think, help apply it to what we do on a daily basis. There’s a new thing that’s happening in pharmaceutical industry and maybe you’ve seen this in the last year, especially with courses of antibiotics where what they do is the packaging involves you taking five white pills and one blue one.
ED Have you seen that? Okay. That is an innovation in customer usage, right? That I think is gonna have profound societal implications. The reason for that is what’s known as chunking, is that if you give somebody a task and you break it into two steps, it’s far more likely that they will do the task than if you just gave them one step. Think, the problem with the antibiotics has been that people take it for a couple days, they start to feel better, and then they stop taking them. And this of course leads to a couple of different problems. Number one, it doesn’t necessarily completely kill the bacteria in their system and also the bacteria that do survive and get passed along to someone else are the ones that are most strong, right? Leading to mutations of bacteria that then require stronger and stronger drugs to get rid of, right?
ED What we really want people to do is make sure that they complete their course of antibiotic when they’re taking it. So what the pharmaceutical companies have figured out is that if they break it down into this two step process, five white and one blue, you’re much more likely to finish it because you have to get to that blue pill.
TODD Artifical goals.
ED Yup. So how this applies, the other thing that I occasionally hear from partner organizations who are working with customers is that they give their customers assignments and the customer doesn’t complete them on time, is that, I don’t know if this has happened to you guys.
TODD No, I mean, all my clients are perfect. Just ask them.
BOB They get everything done they’re supposed to.
ED Uh huh. On time.
BOB On time. Flawlessly.
ED Can we begin to create a chunking process for customers so that when we give them a task we break it down into steps so that the likelihood that they’ll complete it is higher. Now look, this is not perfect. It does not mean that if you do this, your customers are going to become the perfect customers, right? It just means that we know based on research that’s been done that if we assign things that’s even artificially a two step process, the likelihood that they’ll complete it increases.
DARCY I’m thinking of the parenting applications of this myself, but yea.
TODD Does this work on the under 12 crowd?
ED It does. You know why? Because they’re still human beings.
BOB It doesn’t work on the over 12 crowd. That’s my problem.
TODD The 13-18 it’s not so good?
BOB Yea, yea. Probably not at all.
TODD So you saying, so give your customers a second task with each task assignment and assure that they will get to the finish line.
ED Right. So you know, complete this spreadsheet and then cut and paste it into this main spreadsheet.
DARCY Oh my.
TODD Oh dear.
DARCY Okay, and you know what? I’m gonna notice when people are doing that to me from now on. Why do I have to do this second step? Oh, they’re chunking me.
BOB They’re chunking me, that’s right.
ED They’re chunking me, that’s right. But when you begin to see this stuff, it’s just absolutely amazing. And again, Darcy your line. This is an innovation, but it’s not technology, right? It’s not technology. It’s just understanding better that the way the human brain functions and taking advantage of it. it’s brain hacking, I think is what it is.
TODD So to kinda wrap this up and again apply it more towards the ERP market and the partners and people that will be listening to this, how do you get a partner to start thinking this way. Or the executives in a partner channel. How do you get them to step back and figure out, where can I do chunking? Or how can I innovate in my technology business without it being a technological advance?
ED You know, that’s a fantastic question. I think the answer is for people to recognize that in the end, it’s all about changes in language for people. And they have to start using different language inside their organization. And the other thing is, they have to start reading books.
BOB Hang on a minute.
TODD We just lost Bob on that one. Are there pictures?
ED And by reading books, I do mean that you can listen to them on books on tape. And the places to go on this stuff is just different, it can’t be just technical stuff. It’s gotta be some fiction. It’s gotta be some nonfiction, but stuff that isn’t necessarily related to what you do. Like I got many of the ideas from this from Dan Ariely’s book, which again is Predictably Irrational. Another funny one if I just have a few time is organ donorship, why it’s so much higher in Canada than it is in the United States, and it all has to do with the default value, right?
TODD I’ve heard that one before.
ED So the default value in the US is no, you’re not going to be an organ donor and you gotta check yes. And in Canada it’s the other way. It’s yes and you gotta check no. And it’s something like 80/20, right? It’s like 80% of Canadians are organ donors and only 20% in the US. So if you think about this, and this is a great example, too, for our industry of default values, right? How important default values are. And it’s not because Canadians are more altruistic than we are. It’s because when you’re applying for your driver’s license at 16 or 17, nobody is thinking about end of life decisions and the question is out of context. And as a result, I think that we have lots of opportunities for that inside our organization as well. What are we presenting to our customers as the default values? And we really need to think a lot about that ‘cause it’s important. But back to answer your question about how to, I can’t get people to do anything and neither can you and what we can do is we can just offer them the possibility that things could be different if they begin to just look around and see different innovations that are around them. People just have to begin to open their own eyes. I can’t make ‘em do it. But they’re out there and it’s a fascinating science.
TODD I’ll plug one of your other sessions and say that if you haven’t been to Ed’s session on how to ask good questions, that’s a good place to start on how to think about your business differently. ‘Cause it just makes you stop and say, okay the questions I normally ask my client, are those really the best way to get that information? And then that leads to a whole different. We’ve really had some interesting conversations around that session that you did, Ed, at Sage Summit.
ED Oh, good. I’m glad to hear that. That’s some fascinating stuff, too. And if anybody interested, plugging a book on that, the book is A More Beautiful Question by Warren Berger. Really good stuff.
BOB Ed Kless, director at Sage Accountant Solutions and cohost, The Soul of Enterprise and corporate iconoclast. I like saying that.
TODD Wow. Nice.
BOB It’s on his LinkedIn page, which we will link to, of course, on this show page. Thank you for joining us. Notice I didn’t say thank you for your time today because that would be utterly irrelevant in your mind.
DARCY Thanks, Ed. I mean, I feel inspired. I really do. I’m excited and I’m gonna go try and innovate.
TODD I’ve been … emails while we’re talking, so, to people start looking at our website.
ED Well thanks all of you for having me. I really appreciate it. And let’s do this again in the future. Another year or so from now would be great.